April 11, 2008
Just like a bad penny..
Old news keeps resurfacing, I imagine because the subject will always be debatable and there will always be new reasons and new people to debate it.
A recent comment from an online forum referring to Affiliate Funnel..
“I do not see the problem with an owner asking their members to support their business and give them a vote. It creates communication, gets people involved and puts the power in the surfer’s hands where it should be.”
The problem is that once you allow the owners to beg their members for votes it stops being a members choice and becomes ‘how can I bribe my members to vote for me this week and in how many emails.”
Those of us that believe less is more in the email dept would be behind from the beginning. Plus who isn’t going to click a ribbon if you’ll give me 50 or 100 or even more credits.
Are the Affiliate Funnel owners out to make money.. of course they are, we all are, or should be.. no one has a problem with that. But lets not try and turn this obviously skewed and inaccurate system into something more then it was ever intended to be.
I agree with the comments re Affiliate Funnel. While promoting your own business is fine, when that involves getting votes for other programs you own then the results can hardly be considered valid. Affiliate Funnel is a great program mind you. Maybe the owners of Affiliate Funnel that have traffic exchanges should do what Tim Linden over at StartXchange does and take themselves out of the ranking list they are generating/promoting? LOL Just my thoughts.
Hey Martin, you may be very interested to see the next stage of developments for Surfers Choice
Also Paula, I feel you may be slightly mistaken on a couple of points.
If you look through Traffic-Splash or I Love Hits you will not find us requesting votes for our exchanges. You will never see us sending emails asking people to vote for us either.
I belong to over 200 exchanges and read practically every email. I could be wrong but I don’t think I’ve seen one of these exchanges offering bribes to get themselves votes.
IF it has occurred it’s so minor that I never picked up on it.
Hope that clears up the misunderstanding.
cheers
Paul
I don’t see a problem in asking people to vote. When you vote you are ranking multiple exchanges, not just the one asking you. And there isn’t any way to know what they voted.
There was no misunderstanding Paul. Also I think that you may have been mistaken on a couple of points.
First, I didn’t say that Traffic Splash and I Love Hits requested votes on their sites or sent emails asking for them. I think in fact you have been smart enough to not DIRECTLY ask for votes.. the AF ribbon in front of your face immediately when logging in is only an implied request.
But many of the emails from exchanges DO in fact request our vote.
As for exchanges offering bribes, yes, it has been done. Here is an excerpt
from one such email.. names have been x’d out to protect the … guilty?
“Bribery is just dandy! I am sure you have all been hearing about the traffic exchange that is ranked by the surfers.. The only bad thing.. is that not enough people have been voting for xxxxxx - so I am prepared to offer you a bribe! Come and click on this link and give xxxxxx your vote.
Oh - and just to sweeten the deal, I will also add 20 xxxxxx credits in your account for voting for us!”
I stand behind what I’ve said.. Affiliate Funnel is certainly a cute and fun way to rank the exchanges.. but that’s all it is, a fun distraction.
Hi Paula,
Actually, I’ve a sneaky feeling I know who that came from now I re-read it - going to check my gmail archive now just for the fun of it. 
Well done on tracking that one down
I don’t think I’ve seen anybody arguing that any ranking system is better than your own tracking. That advice is repeated constantly in all our own trainings.
However, I continue to believe that good ranking systems are useful guidelines to new surfers.
I strongly believe there is currently no better way to guide new surfers than the AF system.
The top ten sites are put there by the votes of a few thousand surfers. Generally, these are people who’ve been there, seen it, done it.
I wish this had been around when I started. Would have saved me a lot of time and effort.
So yes, I agree it’s a bit of fun but I feel there is a useful purpose too.
There may be others, but what I like about the Affiliate Funnel TE list is that SURFERS can actually vote the exchanges. If you look at the top 10, I would say that the surfers are a pretty dang smart bunch of people. Power to the Surfers!
Cheers!
Tony Tezak
And how are people’s voices ‘innaccurate’? I stand behind AF as being the most accurate form of TE rankings out there.
Why?
Because it’s the members and surfer’s voice. People vote from opinion and opinion will be based on how well the owner treats their membership and the results they get from said program.
Where’s the problem?
As Paul mentioned, I have yet to see any huge ‘bribes’ from owners. And if they do, again, where’s the problem?
It gets people talking traffic exchanges, logging in, surfing, upgrading, taking offers, looking at new pages and a host of other things that benefits everyone invovled, owners and surfers. I just look at the betterment of the industry from something like this, for everyone.
And like Tony said, power to the surfers. It’s about time their voice and opinions are heard, AF let’s them do that.
Didn’t have to ‘track that one down’ Paul.. that particular exchange is in my face daily.
“Because it’s the members and surfer’s voice. People vote from opinion and opinion will be based on how well the owner treats their membership and the results they get from said program.”
But you see… that’s where you’re wrong.
Opinion is NOT based on how well the owner treats their membership and the results they get from said program. It’s based on how many times they were reminded by said program to vote this week and what, if anything, they were offered to do so.
I do agree 100% with you that each surfer should do their own tracking which is the only way they are going to see where they get the most traffic and results from. For instance, I know many other surfers that agree with me on the delivery and effectiveness of EasyHits4U.. It is by far my best producer as far as traffic and results but not even listed in Af.. oh wait.. they don’t ask their membership to vote for them…
Naw, they didn’t even ask to be a part of AF.
How can people vote, if an exchange doesn’t give their membership the opportunity to do so. And I agree, it’s a great performer, I’m sure they would rank quite well in AF.
Again, what is the problem with getting people active and asking for votes? I myself have not, and will not. But I won’t think any less of an exchange that does so.
Do this and get that has been a part of marketing and business for years. Nothing wrong with it.
As a surfer I find it insulting that you would presume that I would be swayed by the chance to earn a few credits just to vote for a certain traffic exchange. I vote for the exchange that has brought me the most opt-ins that week. Its simple marketing, if I vote for the best it stays on top and my business grows. Its a no brainer “Really” Newbie Internet Marketing
I find it ironic that AF is the center of this seemingly negative article when the TE owner(s) that practice the soliciting of votes is “protected”.
I’ve never seen or heard AF encourages TE owners to bribe their members. If you you have a problem with the practice, then you need the name the owners and write about them.
For the record, I don’t have a problem with owners emailing and/or bribing their members to go out and vote.
Even if you offer credits to people for voting that does not mean they will vote the way you want them to. For example, XYZ exchange sends me an e-mail offering credits for voting. I don’t use XYZ much, if at all, because it hasn’t provided me with good results, so I do vote for it in the AF rankings but I give it a 2 out of 10. I took the credit bribe, regardless of what I ranked XYZ as. So, the rank that I gave was accurate, credit bribe or not.
Of course AF doesn’t encourage programs to bribe their members. They’re too smart for that.. I never said they weren’t good businessmen, some of the best.
And I’m not about to call out by name any exchange that does.. that’s not my style. Anyone who reads their emails knows who they are anyway..
If owners want to email and/or bribe their exchanges.. fine.. go for it.. I don’t have a problem with it.. and I DO think the surfers are smart enough not to be swayed, I’ve never thought otherwise.. HitSafari is in the AF top 10 and I don’t display the ribbon or ask for votes..
BUT
to lead people that are new to the industry to believe that AF is the Surfers Choice and therefore the best of the best… the brand new era of our surfers coming first.. that I have a problem with.
It is the Surfer’s Choice. It’s what people vote for. It’s their opinion and what better way to recommend exchanges to new surfer than the ones people like the most?
Me thinks this is another vendetta against AF because like Harry pointed out, you are quick to call us out, but not the program in question.
Would you have bothered with this post, if YOU were the owner of a ranking system based on votes?
I find it quite distasteful that you work at putting a negative light on Affiliate Funnel while not disclosing the exchange offering bribes. I see this as a blatant call out using a well known name to gain attention for yourself. Pittiful.
In any setup where you allow the general public to vote, there will be the oppourtunity for corruption. Look at any group of people practising democracy. I also agree with Tim, taking a “bribe” does not guarentee a good vote, especially when my vote is unseen and I can express my own opinion.
Not sure if this is the right place but wish Paula a quick recovery and back on deck soon after her stay in hospital …kai1yu23